[barryrpf]

I'm hoping for some advice on this. Given the L-shaped kitchen I am working with, and taking into account dimensions and the need for a fridge, sink range and I want lots of pantry space, I don't have a lot of simple workspace. That is the situation now. We are busting out a wall between the kitchen and the dining room to open it up...we hardly use the dining room now and want to make it our main eating room. It has a lovely 6 foot wide window in it that will add a lot to the natural light in the room.

So, I am adding an island between the kitchen and dining room. Due to a number of factors, the island will serve the tasks of food preparation (no stove, no sink) with a raised bar for eating (i.e. quick breakfasts, lunches). By the way my ceilings are only 8ft tall and I am planning on going Adel MB. I want to maximize the size of the island length (6 ft). Here are my questions.
1) IKEA base cabinets are only available in 24 inches deep. So, would a 24 inch x 72 inch island look too long and skinny. The bar will add a little to the width but not much. I know I would stick a couple of 12'' cabinets sideways to make a wider base for a 36 inch deep work surface.

2) I really like the design and look of the IKEA capita brackets although they look like they would be tricky to install, especially in a granite countertop. What I don't like about them is they don't accomplish two objectives for having a raised bartop eating area in the first place 1) to hide the mess on the food prep area from the dining room. and 2)not so much an objective but with a closed back island you can leave items out along the back edge of the island against a 6-8 inch "wall" without fear of them either falling off or looking terrible from the dining room side of things. Any advice on a different way to do this or how do you like the capita approach? I know some use a high wall cabinet on the outside edges of the bar top but this eats up valuable sitting room.

3) lighting advice...I plan to install recessed lights but over the island. I really like the look of 3 or so mini-pendant lights. But with only a 8ft ceiling, and an 33 inch counterop, and given the light itself would be 8-10 inches...it doesn't leave a lot of distance for the "hanging" part of it. I measured roughly and I might get like 12-16 inches of cord above the light fixture itself. Do you think this would look too short and stubby. Some of the awesome photos I've seen in this forum have long hanging lights, obviously they have pretty high ceilings because they appear to hang a long way from the ceiling and still be well above the countertop. I also don't want the lights so low that they were in your way looking from the kitchen out across the bartop into the dining room on the other side.

All for now. Lots to think about now that I've pretty much decided to take the plunge but I must admit, its kinda fun too.

Barry

[GregPhil]

For my sister's kitchen we hung a couple of pendants from her 8' ceiling over the island. No issues with looking from kitchen to family room. If I remember correctly it's about 21" from ceiling to bottom of the lights. Have a picture (not a good angle tho) in my gallery. It's the first one. Suggest that you put them on a dimmer. In the evening when you are in the family room having the lights on dimmed gives the kitchen a warm glow. Nice effect beyond the practical aspect of needing illumination.

[DesignDiva]

I am not a fan of bar-height bars...the stools are awkward to get into, things roll off the back and they break up a lovely continuous useful surface. But if you still want to go with one, use the 39" high wall cabinets as your base cabinets on that side. That will give you the extra height you need for the bar top and also give you the solid back on the island side. You might even be able to add outlets on the "backsplash" area on the working side.

There is a lot to be said for the all-one-height island. Mine is 4 feet by 5 feet and we use it almost continuously daily for all sorts of things, from wrapping presents to assembling furniture to homework, sewing projects, food prep, you name it. I have seating on two adjacent sides. I have drawers on the working side and shallow wall cabs with full height doors on the seating side. The mess while we're cooking isn't a big deal to me...we do tidy up afterwards. You can always use a large vase or something in the center to create a small visual barrier.

Our lighting is slightly offset because I didn't want glare off magazines for seated diners who read while they eat. Another way to accomplish this is with lighting that shines upward, but I loved the lights I got and they shine downward, so I offset them. My ceilings are 8 feet, and we used a hanging light from IKEA which is 35 inches above countertop at the bottom, the entire fixture including cord is 24 inches.

[barryrpf]

Thanks to both for your comments. This is really is a good website isn't it?.

Both of your measurements really helped...I figured 20 to 24 inches I could do and your photos show that they don't look stubby. Your lights Eva look great, not the long narrow pendant style I was considering but they may work better for me. When you say offset, how far? i.e. would it be far to say that they are centered over the edge of the island...working side of not quite that far off center?

I may rethink the bartop counter and I think I would go with tall wall cabinets instead of the IKEA capita mounts if I do. I do like the idea of a "backsplash" on this working surface to line up containers...e.g. flour/sugar/coffee/tea pottery jars...and it may be a lot easier to install electrical...definitely need this. Eva how did you work electrical into your same/height island? Anybody else?

I think using the wall cabinet instead of the brackets I will naturally have a wider counter space so I will not have to worry about the long/skinny look. How much overhang do you have Eva for your countertop to allow the chairs to tuck in and people can site comfortably without their knees pushed up against the cabinet?

Thanks again folks.
Barry

[DesignDiva]

If you drew a smaller rectangle on my island top, offset 1 foot from each of the seating sides, I centered the lights over that rectangle. They light the countertop, but don't cause that spotlight glare where diners are seated.

I am on a slab, so I don't have electric in my island since it would have involved cutting a trench through the slab to run conduit. We have a power strip mounted at the side of the island with the cord running through a hole in the side and down through the bottom. When we need it, which is rare (two or three times a year) we run the cord under a cord manager to the wall and plug it in. That gives us power without anyone tripping over the wire on the floor. Even without electric, we use the island all the time!
There is space behind the drawers in the base cabinets to run conduit so if you ca get the power to the island, you can certainly put outlets where you want them. My local code requires attachment to the floor if electric, gas or water is on the island...my island isn't attached, it's on Capita legs. Check your local code for spacing requirements for outlets and any other requirements they might have.

My overhang is 12" on the side, which is the minimum I'd recommend for counter height. You could go deeper if you wanted. At bar height, 12" would be adequate since people won't have their knees bent at 90 degrees like you do at counter or table height. So if you used the cabinets, you'd have 12" on top of the cabinets plus another 12" overhang for a total surface of 24" at bar height.

[GregPhil]

Re: Island Size and Island Lighting advice 

My sister's overhang is 10", which I will admit is pretty much the bare minimum, but it does work with hardly any knee bumping. A couple of inches more would be best, but one also has to consider the amount of overhang if using granite with no visible brackets.

[barryrpf]

GregPhil raises a good point. Using granite and overhangs. I don't see brackets for this at IKEA unlike some of the other companies, but I wondered if you could put a piece of 5/8 inch plywood as a base for the granite to rest on, stopping the plywood 4 inches or so shy of the bottom edge of the granite. That way, the granite would have added support from the wood and the plywood would be hidden.

Another person on this site, can't remember who or exactly the context, mentioned Adel MB trim of some sort, sounded like a rounded trim that he used on exposed cabinet edges below the countertop I think.

If I was making a raised bar using two 12 inch wall cabinets turned sideways, 24 inches deep, with a 24 inch countertop, it would mean overhanging the wall cabinets 12 inches, with the middle of the bartop having no other support at all....only a 24 inch by 24 inch section I know but a piece of plywood would provide for a lot of strength I would think.??

[Dave of the Coonties]

Barry, I just wanted to make sure you've noticed that Ikea base cabinets come in 12" depth. Here's a current example. Please help reviewing our design!

Best wishes with lighting. It's astonishing how many designs are available.

[barryrpf]

Thanks Dave. I did see that but didn't give them much though. I have revised my plan to have just a flat island (no bartop), on one end have a 12 inch pullout, the other end an open shelf for mail..etc. These would not have much overhang countertop above. The mail shelf is 9 inches wide but I figure I can use a panel to close in the 3 inches difference so that it is even with the other units. IN between though, facing the seating area a simple 12 inch deep (18 inches wide) base cabinet. Will not be used a lot but will provide storage for those once in a blue moon items.

I am assuming that this Ikea stuff is fairly easy to connect together pieces, side to side sure, but back to back or side to back?? Even if it isn't set up now to do that a drill, some bolts and washers should suffice, no?

[Dave of the Coonties]

barryrpf, Ikea offers superabundant kitchen options, so it's really easy to not notice possibilities.

I'm following kitchen design issues so as to learn from other's experiences before undertaking my own. To judge from my towering wall of Billy bookcases, a few bolts, washers, and nuts will do wonders to hold things together.

I'm seeing that a clever/skilled handyperson can do remarkable things with Ikea cabinets and parts. The rest of us are likely to do fine, and even do some useful hacking.