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Old Jun 18th, 08, 12:02 pm   #1
leeannem978
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Costs of green vs. not-so-green?

I'm looking for information on cost points for eco friendly products. I'm thinking of bamboo flooring and some sort of eco friendly counter top solution for my kitchen.

However, I do have a budget and noticed the price for one of the eco-friendly counter products was $100-150 per square foot , it was Icestone I believe. I can't afford that and look laminates starting at about $15-20/square foot as a more budget friendly option for sure!

Thoughts? Ideas on eco friendly & wallet friendly products?

Thanks.
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Old Jun 18th, 08, 12:32 pm  
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Re: Costs of green vs. not-so-green?

This has been brought up before ... and sometimes, how green a product is is more a matter of how much green it'll suck out of one's wallet!

That said, particle board itself is already a recycled product, albeit of industrial production and not post consumer, so on that aspect, it's on the greener side versus solid wood. A bigger factor here would be the resins used in the manufacturing ... all of Ikea's meet the more stringent Euro standards for low VOC's and formaldehyde.
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Old Jun 18th, 08, 12:38 pm  
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Re: Costs of green vs. not-so-green?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Narf View Post
This has been brought up before ... and sometimes, how green a product is is more a matter of how much green it'll suck out of one's wallet!
Unfortunately for me, I think that the $$ aspect of this is going to be bigger deal for me vs eco-friendliness
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Old Jun 18th, 08, 1:02 pm  
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Re: Costs of green vs. not-so-green?

It can get quite expensive, but there are green alternatives out there. If bamboo flooring is too pricey, what about marmoleum? That's a green product -- or cork? If you are going with bamboo, and you want to do it to be green, you may need to look into the company: how the bamboo is harvested (older is better), from where it is shipped (will never be the US I believe), what adhesives are used... not all bamboo flooring is the same and not all companies handle the same.

I looked into Icestone and Enviroglas and was awed by the price. We went with quartz from Caesarstone -- which is still pricey but which came in wider slabs, so we could get our entire kitchen out of one pricey slab whereas with the Icestone (and a narrower slab), we would've had to purchase two slabs. Other countertop ideas could be recycled Corian or recycled porcelain tiles. (I know quartz is controversial as a green product -- ours was flown in from Israel, which isn't great, but the company is environmentally-friendly, which is a plus. In the end, I wanted a durable white countertop and I couldn't afford Icestone.)

I just read a bit on recycled particleboard laminate countertops -- that sounds cool. I think Skyblend is one of the manufacturers. You'd want to be sure (if you want to be green) that the laminate uses no-VOC adhesives.

Richlite and Paperstone (recycled paper) are much less than Icestone. I've used Shetkastone (also recycled paper), and it looks great. It was a little pricer than Richlite, I think. It also scratches easily -- think slightly less durable than Corian. I love it in the bathroom -- not sure I'd use it in a kitchen. I don't have personal experience with Richlite or Paperstone.

Good luck!
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Old Jun 19th, 08, 8:57 pm  
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Re: Costs of green vs. not-so-green? hardwood flooring

A couple of things to start...first i am seriously considering cork, not so much because it is green but because of qualities of it...easy to stand on, insulating, .etc. Second, I am a forester...not a logger, not a sawmill person, but a forest management person that works in an area where products cut here end up in hardwood flooring, and to a lesser extent furniture and cabinetry I suppose. But flooring is the main local value-added mill.

The notion that bamboo (because it can be harvested in 3 years, almost like an agricultural crop) or cork (because the tree is not killed) are more green than hardwood flooring is not necessarily true and perhaps just the opposite.

Sustainable forest management principles can be used to harvest trees, provide local well-paying jobs with strict health and safety requirements, often unionized, allow the forest to be renewed, maintain wildlife habitat values and even enhance habitat for many species, and, in the case of most species grown for hardwood flooring, done so without the need for herbicides, fertilizers, plantation type forests plus distance to market is much less (for the North American market anyways) so less pollution, etc.

What is the health and safety protection for workers harvesting bamboo or cork...are they fairly compensated, how is wildlife habitat affected, are the areas more like a natural environment or is more of an agricultural field, are indingenous peoples way of life dramatically altered for little or no compensation and what energy/pollutions costs are there for bringing that material from thousands of miles away? I'm not claiming to know the answers on those points but I do know that much of the North American native solid (and engineered) wood floors stack up pretty well in those regards.

So, how can you tell if the wood product you are buying comes from a well-managed forest from a social and environmental perspective? Those that bear the FSC (forest stewardship council) label - look for it, mark down the code from the certifying , check it out on the internet of that company and you may be able to determine where the wood actually came from if you like. If you don't see certified flooring, or whatever wood product, ask your retailer about it.

Even red oak/maple/birch/beech hardwood flooring that is not FSC certified may still be as green or greener than some of the so-called green products like bamboo and cork. FSC is an independant certifying body and certification is voluntary for companies and mills...it doesn't mean the forest was not well-managed...their is just no proof of it. There are other certification systems out there that does some, most of or slightly different than FSC but still gets to pretty much the same thing...sustainably managed forests.

The notion that cutting a tree down to make a product (i.e. killing a tree) makes that product not green is ridiculous. In the forest I help manage, we remove more of the diseased trees first, releasing younger, healthy trees, keeping many larger trees, trees with holes in them because many of our wildlife species need those trees, a number of trees that produce valuable food (e.g. not cut all the beech or oak down to maintain a supply of beechnuts and acorns for wildlife).

Looking at the forest and the trees....
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